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 No.2[Reply]

File: 1559435267262.png (905.05 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, Mayor,_Let's_get_galloping….png) ImgOps Google

Welcome to /townhall/! This is an anonymous-only board for debates, dialectics, and discussions of a serious nature.

As the topics discussed on this board may deal with sensitive or controversial subject matter, we expect a higher standard of conduct than elsewhere on the site, and will enforce the board's rules with a greater degree of strictness. Inability or unwillingness to follow the rules will result in a /townhall/-only ban.

 No.3

1) All posts in a given thread must contribute constructively to the conversation, whether agreeing or disagreeing. Off-topic, contentless, inflammatory, or hostile posts will be deleted and result in a ban.

1a) Derails that occur as a natural result of discussion progressing from the original subject will generally not be interfered with; however, if these hinder discussion of the original topic, making a new thread is preferred.

1b) Part of contributing constructively is understanding and addressing the reasoning behind an opposing view. While this can be a tedious task and will generally not be officially enforced, please make an effort to at the very least avoid "talking past" someone when presented with a counterargument. Simply doubling down on your initial point does not advance a discussion.

1c) Be as willing to "lose" as you are to "win", and above all else, be willing to learn and understand. You will not get the most out of this board if your only goal is to persuade, and you will not even be effective at that unless you understand what you are arguing against.


2) Ad hominems and other uncivil behavior will not be tolerated. You may have a significant personal stake in some subjects discussed here, and it is normal to be frustrated when someone cannot relate; however, lashing out is not an effective way to engender sympathy for your position, and will not advance the conversation in a constructive way. Even if you find someone's argument morally abhorrent, there are constructive ways to express this.

2a) Attempting to deliberately provoke an uncivil reaction is prohibited, even if it is done within the letter of the law.

2b) Snark and other forms of mockery are strongly discouraged and may result in warnings or bans.

2c) "Strawmanning" an "opponent" deliberately will be regarded as uncivil conduct and will be dealt with accordingly. This will not apply to genuine misunderstandings.


3) While we do not claim to be arbiters of absolute moral or empirical truth and aim to moderate this board in a fair and even-handed, politically agnostic manner, the following extreme positions are considered "off-limits" regardless of how they are put forward, including attempts to "hint" or dogwhistle:

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 No.16202[Reply]

File: 1751160090944.jpg (295.5 KB, 1080x1637, 1080:1637, 20250625_211027.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

How could the Empire have been better off?
1 post omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.16205

>>16202
Don't touch America.
They, like the Romans, only understand total war.

 No.16206

>>16205
Probably right.

 No.16207

Pearl Harbor attack was based on a flawed US doctrine at the time that the war would be decided by a single grand battle. Sinking the fleet at Pearl Harbor would make that battle win able. It ended up not mattering.

Japan historically had invaded SEA before Pearl Harbor so I'm not sure why this is a different option from the historical one, as the objective at Pearl Harbor was to facilitate defeating the USN.

Problem with withdrawing. By 1941 it would have been politically impossible. The entire justification of the East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere was that aggressive expansion wasn't just a right but an obligation. The Tojo regime was marked by extreme political violence and a very successful propaganda campaign. The result of an official seriously proposing withdrawal from China when the Empire knew nothing but victory would have been that official getting assassinated, executed, of otherwise purged, as was common practice in Japan at the time.


In my opinion the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere was a doomed fantasy built on a flawed premise and a disconnect from reality. There's no way to make it viable.


 No.16187[Reply]

File: 1750978516738.png (1.52 MB, 1936x1440, 121:90, trixie.png) ImgOps Google

Donald Trump owned casinos, which exploited people's gambling addictions, and he filed for bankruptcy six times in order to try to game the system. He is now considered by a subset of America to be the greatest President of the modern era because of these skills and capabilities. The Republican party either generally supports this or is merely using him as a means to advance their own agenda -- each possibility distasteful. Republicans promote opposite values in their campaigns.
11 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.16199

>>16197
>Which is still just as meaningless as the first bundle.
An opportunist is someone who lacks moral and ethical concern, instead focusing on getting what they want -- see Kohlberg's Levels of Moarlity - level 2, self-interest, for further reading.

>That makes the context even more confusing.
I mean I never heard Ramsey suggest to his callers that they should game the system, as Trump has done, in order to improve their finances. Yet, this is considered OK by Trump supporters. In other words, there is a double standard -- Trump is allowed to do it because he's rich and he's Trump, but regular people are still discouraged away from doing it.

>That still appears to have nothing to do with what was discussed at hand.
The relevance is that Fundamentalist Christians say people should be moral, yet many appear unable to tell when their moral inclinations are being manipulated, don't care, or supports such manipulation. This leads them to voting against their interests.

>Which seems to be your assumption, and not something you've spent any time even backing up, at this stage.
This would require research, but I'm pretty sure the idea came out of a populist social reform movement. Money only exists as a tool to the wealthy. For the middle, working, and lower classes, it has cultural significance. For them, bankruptcy was meant to remove the social stigma of being in debt and give someone a fresh start at the house, wife, and pension.

>>16198
the magazine article does raise some questions, such as -- was trump originally embarrassed and trying to hide his first bankruptcies? Then after a while, he just got used to them so changed his story?

 No.16200

>>16199
>An opportunist is someone who lacks moral and ethical concern
Which again, still leaves absolutely nothing for me to go off of in the original context.
He's an opportunist because... What? He just is?

>I mean I never heard Ramsey suggest to his callers that they should game the system, as Trump has done,
Assuming you are correct that he's "gamed" the system, is Donald Trump this Ramsey character?
From what you've described, seeing as you've labeled him an "opportunist" with an explicit moral derision, I would think it pretty irrelevant what he thinks.
Certainly he is not the entirety of Trump supporters either.

Why must Donald Trump, and anyone who supports him, abide by the divine will of Ramsey as though his word comes straight from the heavens themselves?
Seems rather absurd to me. Near as I can tell, there's nothing to justify such a thing, beyond perhaps a conflation of two individuals as the same because they're on the same 'side' politically, which even itself might be a stretch.

>The relevance is that Fundamentalist Christians say people should be moral, yet many appear unable to tell when their moral inclinations are being manipulated, don't care, or supports such manipulation.
Okay, but based on what?
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 No.16204

My politics


 No.16201[Reply]

Conventional economics is brain damage


 No.16186[Reply]

Elon Musk alone has caused more harm to people than the entirety of the left


 No.16181[Reply]

Non-MAGA evangelical takes down MAGA evangelical's bullshit dishonest representation of the Bible to justify ICE raids.

 No.16185

Slightly old, but a good breakdown of the role disgust plays in twisting Christianity for the sake of "Christian" nationalism.


 No.15704[Reply]

.
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 No.16168

>>16159

This is the weakest criticism I've ever seen anywhere online. Utterly lacking in self awareness.

>>16162

>editorial content
>serious political philosophy
>pretending political cartoons aren't traditional

>>16164

>Fundamentally they only ever consider, let alone show, one side.

Editorial content has no obligation to be 'balanced'. It's literally a way of expressing an opinion, and if that's in reference to current events then of cpurse their going to reference the news their commenting on, of course their presenting their opinion alone. You consume other people's editorial content to get their opinions in response. Frankly this seems like a real stretch to try and play the victim over something that's been a well established practice in media for literally centuries. Editorial content is not reporting, is expressing opinions, thats what an editorial section of a newspaper fundamentally is, and the vast majority of content about politics posted on YouTube is editorial in nature, as well as the majority of content on cable news channels.

 No.16174

>>16168
Political cartoons are and have always been simple propaganda.
The default state for them is strawmanning the opposition.
You are right they have no obligation to be balanced; they are within their rights to be propaganda.
But acting as though it's consequently anything but propaganda is asinine at best.

 No.16180



 No.16079[Reply]

File: 1750562499428.jpg (116.96 KB, 640x828, 160:207, normal guy.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

If you ever believed a word this man said, you were only ever telling everyone else how fucking gullible you are
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 No.16178

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 No.16179

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 No.16183

Oh I know, I know... the Democrats just need more Superdelegates to make sure the vote comes out properly. Can't have the people getting their way unless their choice is pre-approved by the party commissars.


 No.16078[Reply]

File: 1750562335248.jpg (79.4 KB, 1174x244, 587:122, imagine.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

this is beyond words. deeply fucking stupid people.
2 posts and 1 image reply omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.16172

File: 1750713985371.png (318.08 KB, 1080x1144, 135:143, Screenshot_20250623-142746.png) ImgOps Google

>>16078
Lol, this aged poorly.  Iran lobbed a few missiles at a US base in Qatar, and now both sides are done with each other.  No ongoing war.

 No.16173

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 No.16182

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 No.16167[Reply]

File: 1750685546781.jpg (171.08 KB, 877x659, 877:659, not the onion dot jp.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

Say what you like about Israel but they do have a sense of humor I'll give them that


 No.16098[Reply]

File: 1750612576293.png (3.28 MB, 1991x1111, 181:101, CRINK-Challenge-Image.png) ImgOps Google

America should be at war with the China-x-Iran-x-Russian-x-North-Korean alliance (which I've seen sometimes called the 'CRINK' alliance).

This is very obviously the right thing to do. This is a completely ethically justified conflict. These are thoroughly evil regimes that're absolute dictatorships that engage in not just brutal violence against innocents domestically on the basis of bloodthirsty ultranationalist authoritarianism, with ethnic, religious, and racial hatred being let loose, but also against innocents in other nations. They're supporting organized crime. They're supporting terrorism. They're fueling everything from homophobia to religious prejudice to transphobia and more. They're making the world a worse place.

I support Donald Trump's invasion of Iran. I totally do. This is likely the singular first time in my entire life that I've ever seen him say or do anything that's correct, with him being so predicably wrong for multiple decades now that you can almost metaphysically set your watch to him in opposition, but "better late than never".

As somebody who's voted against Trump multiple times over the past several years and am extremely glad since Hillary Clinton very obviously would've been a better President (this is an objective fact) and Joe Biden very obviously was a better President (this is an objective fact), I'm saying this without any regret, let alone any irony: Thank You President Trump.

Down with China. Down with Iran. Down with Russia. Down with North Korea.

And, well, up with Trump.

Who's with me? Who has courage? Who has intelligence? Who is willing to stand against fascism?
8 posts and 1 image reply omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.16152

File: 1750644400504.png (170.75 KB, 625x311, 625:311, troll.png) ImgOps Google


 No.16158

>>16147
Democrats and their liberal supporters have always been much more inclined towards wars than the left. OP is clearly not leftist.

 No.16166

File: 1750665937189.png (577.17 KB, 901x889, 901:889, 1732011064812.png) ImgOps Google

Feels good to get off your chest doesn't it? Seriously. Every single country you listed off as a government does not have the US' best interest in mind what so ever.

>>16117
Wanting to remain on 'peaceful terms with world powers while standing your ground are two things that aren't mutually exclusive.

The world powers are and have always been fake friends


 No.16068[Reply]

File: 1750492593759.png (450.23 KB, 1162x654, 581:327, republicanattacks.png) ImgOps Google

...looks like republicans have begun their attack on students. I had been holding out that they might actually help students, especially ones who do well in school by increasing federal student aid and tying it to grades (a sensible conservative position), but they did the opposite.

In short, house republicans wanted to cut the Pell grant for people paying by the credit-hour by increasing the course workload for full Pell grant eligibility from 12 to 15 credit hours, but the senate has rejected the change. They also wanted to reduce the aggregate student loan limit from $57,500 to $50,000 for undergraduates, despite it hasn't been increased in 20 years and there is such a thing as inflation, which devalues that amount.

If you want to get a Master's (becoming a standard requirement for jobs, nowadays), your aggregate loan limit will be drastically reduced from $147,500 to $100,000 (undergraduate loans included) -- so, really if you max out undergrad loans a decrease from $90,000 to $42,500. As Master's programs are more expensive and the Pell grant can't be applied to them, the cut will price people out of everything but the cheapest, lowest-quality, likely online-only schools.

In addition, loans will now be pro-rated, the same as Pell grants currently are, based on part or full-time enrollment. So, if I'm understanding it correctly, you will only get half of your needed living expenses if you only attend part-time -- making it harder to be a student.

Lastly, Grad PLUS loans will be eliminated, which were loans that you could apply for if you were pursuing a Master's degree and your credit wasn't too awful, to help finish paying for college if you max out your other loans.

People entering law school would still have a $200k aggregate student loan limit, so if you want to be a student as long as possible, that might be a path if you can find a cheap online law school.

That having been said, there are still some fairly-easy online-only schools one can find and attend. But as for ever attending a nice college to get your Master's if you're from a middle or working-class family -- don't see how it would be possible, anymore, with these changes.

I expect that Republicans will continue to attack the working, middle-class, and poor so long as they are in power. As the divide between rich and poor increases, and the middle class disappears, recommended financial strategies include either 1) become an enPost too long. Click here to view the full text.
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 No.16146

>>16142
>with a high return on investment
Which hasn't been the case for years.
Yes. That was my point.

 No.16148

>>16146
There are plenty of studies which say that they still have a good return on investment, especially in STEM fields. In addition, just because the return on investment is declining slightly, it's no reason to pre-emptively punish students (who were promised the house, wife, pension and little american flag to wave at the barbecue if they did good in school) through legislation, unless perhaps you happen to be a billionaire who happens to have no further use for the remaining cultural capital of your society and is therefore more interested in turning everyone into worker drones to help protect their wealth than in improving society as a whole.

 No.16149

>>16148
Or I could look at this much as I did for Obamacare and notice how prices skyrocketed when the state started handing out credit with great terms.

That ending, I just can't really bring myself to care about.
And i don't really buy the claim that there's a good return in the modern context anyways.
Seems to me from most folk I've talked to, college degrees are for working fast food these days.


 No.15299[Reply]

File: 1746767313091.png (66.3 KB, 498x281, 498:281, kiff-disney-kiff.png) ImgOps Google

Now that the dust has settled, I'll just be the one to say it...

Trump isn't that bad
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 No.16085

File: 1750572117408.jpg (216.99 KB, 2560x1920, 4:3, 71CFX8ZhTkL.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

>>15300
Europeans upset that we are no longer funding their handouts at American taxpayer expense? Oh no! So anyway...

 No.16097

File: 1750587396903.jpg (144.19 KB, 519x1148, 519:1148, 20250312_011538.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

Glad to see our country going strong.

 No.16104

>>15299
I'm hoping to survive until he dies in office of natural causes, since that's literally the only way for him to not be in charge.


 No.16075[Reply]

Trump's ego could lead us world war 3.
4 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.16095

>>16092
Yes, I believe that's what Ron Paul was against -- and rightly so, as 1) there was no reason to attack and 2) you can't go to war without authorization by congress, which every president since WWII seems to always conveniently forget.

As far as helping Israel goes, the u.s.'s role should be de-escalating conflict and staying out of foreign wars, not picking sides and joining in.

 No.16096

>>16095
I agree. And we all know that war and "war" are basically the same thing and is a moot point.
Unfortunately Israel is an ally of the US. That means the US has obligations whether the people want it or not. Unlike for example Ukraine, which many people in the US wanted us to get directly involved in despite not being anything remotely close to allies. And while de-escalation would be ideal, getting dragged in is a very real and justifiable possibility, whether people want it or not. And that aspect is completely independent of Trump.

 No.16099

>>16075
No, World War Three as such has been going on for multiple years now, especially after the attempts at genocide in terms of wiping out the Israeli people as well as the attempts at genocide in terms of wiping out the Ukrainian people.

And there are the threatened calls for future genocides against the people of South Korea as well as the people of Taiwan, both of which have to get prevented from even being attempted in the first place.

Fighting back is completely morally correct. The Chinese government alongside the Iranian, North Korean, and Russian regimes can't be allowed to just gleefully slaughter innocents and try to impose a new 'iron curtain' of authoritarianism across Asia and Europe.


 No.16077[Reply]

File: 1750562249901.jpg (222.58 KB, 2726x1532, 1363:766, whoops.jpg) ImgOps Exif Google

If you voted for trump you are actually retarded.


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