[ home ] [ pony / townhall / rp / canterlot / rules ] [ arch ]

/townhall/ - Townhall

A place for civilized animals
Password (For file deletion.)

[Return][Go to bottom]


File: 1713791325228.png (510.77 KB, 1137x1919, 1137:1919, Grand_Duchy_of_Finland_Arm….png) ImgOps Google

Instead of annexing Finland into the Russian Empire, Alexander I of Russia organized Finland as an autonomous grand duchy and acted as its head of state.  This autonomy allowed Finnish culture and national identity to flourish despite being part of a larger empire.  Are there any lessons to be learned from this that are applicable to the modern world?


My understanding is that the mostly successful situation of having the territories culturally and economically flourish under a broader Russian government umbrella only worked when the Russian military held some international respect as a force capable of maintaining civic order no matter what.

In 1905, Russia faced a humiliating defeat in the Russo-Japanese War. And I believe that was a fundamental turning point. Many effects across both Asia and Europe.

I suppose the core political lesson is that while a system of government with more devolution to local peoples and more rights held by the individual the better, still there's no substitute for the sheer power of having an adequate military that has popular respect and maintains basic authority. A country without basic strength is a country about to internally fall apart. I suppose.



Your points are well taken about the importance of military strength.  I think Finnish culture is also a factor.  Unlike the Palestinian Gazans, Finns didn't launch rocket attacks against Russia or conduct terrorist attacks of raping and murdering.  I guess Israel's strong military response is necessary to demonstrate its military strength.


I've thought some more about the exact line from that historical article:

<"The costly and humiliating series of Russian defeats in the Russo-Japanese War left the Russian Empire demoralized, [and] added to Russians’ growing anger at the failed policies of Czar Nicholas II".>

While a population being "demoralized" (versus being what I would call the opposite of being "more and more confident") is a subjective label, I do think it's clear-cut that if multiple sets of peoples view their government as fundamentally incompetent and unintelligent that such an impression has numerous political effects.


It's actually really interesting how ethnic Swedes fostered and encouraged Finnish culture following the Finnish War and how conflicting interests between Russian and Swedish authorities lead to Finland developing in a very unique way politically.

... and we aren't talking about Finland at all, are we? This is another fucking proxy issue to talk about some other retard shit on the sly.


I guess my OP was a flop; not much to discuss on that topic, so discussion pivoted to other topics.


I'm one of those weird people who actively enjoy talking about historical facts that happened before my parents were born. So, well, I don't care too much about hidden motivations.

W.r.t. Russia versus its neighbors, its interesting to note that Czar Alexander III deliberately avoided any major wars to the point that he's been known ever since as "The Peacemaker" (Russian: Миротворец, tr. Mirotvorets) and has the international title among historians as the "Tsar’-Mirotvorets".

For all the notions that warfare results in fame, that Czar's efforts at friendship with the French specifically resulted in the creation of the Pont Alexandre III, an ornate arch bridge spanning the Seine in Paris, which still stands today. This goes to show that intelligent moderation can also cause fame. At least, in some circumstances.


The Finns were handed over as spoils of war. Russia didn't care as much about the Finns ad people, and cared more about having a buffer zone between Sweden and important Russian cities. Russia had just surrendered to Napoleon and was brought under his influence, where Sweden was still an active belligerent against Napoleon.

Finland also absolutely was annexed. Being an autonomous ducky didn't mean fuck all when your Duke was the Emperor. The reason Finnish culture was allowed to exist is because the Tsars didn't care about them enough to try and Russify the area.


A reminder:


[Return] [Go to top]
[ home ] [ pony / townhall / rp / canterlot / rules ] [ arch ]