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> be on toilet
> visit by adequately sized wolf spider
> capture under plastic cup

> ant invasion
> catch stray worker ant
> put under plastic cup with wolf spider
> ant causciously explores the cup
> runs into spider
> startled spider flinches and moves to the opposite side of the cup

What the hay, spider? Are you supposed to cower before food? You're like 10 times larger than it.


Ant's will fuck you up


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Spiders are phenomenally dumb.


I'm lucky they are the harmless kind to my person.

I do wonder how spiders go by sometimes.
Does it know its trapped and might that make it a bit stressed?

The ant was pretty fearless there.


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I know house spiders are able to sense sound.


Ants are pretty bold, they don't really run easily. Or at least their default instinct is the explore. Spiders are pretty skittish things that would rather hide than have a direct confrontation. They trap and/or ambush.

Whats more, the spider isn't much danger to an ant, I don't think it could actually even eat an ant. It doesn't have teeth and the ant is probably too small to inject with venom. Even if it could, it isn't like it has hands to grab the ant.

On the other hand, a single ant probably wouldn't harm a spider but a group of ants could easily overwhelm a spider and kill it. Ants are crazy fuckers. Or in other words: >>745105

I don't think a spider can feel stressed. It was probably just reacting instinctively in a defensive manner. I can't even imagine it understood that it was trapped. If it was standing still until it was touched, then it must have had no stimuli it needed to react to.


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I suppose spiders are solitary animals and ants are part of colony.

For an individual spider, survival is important, while ants have expendability programmed into their existence.

Now I really wonder how it would feel to be any of them for only one day (minus the risk of dying of course)


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then again, when I offer ants sugar, they do seem eager to abandon whatever they're doing there and lick it like it's some sort of crack.

And just as I'm thinking of ants and spiders I see one of the latter sneaking past my headboard close enough that it would have been eaten in my sleep if it moved a few inches down.


Spiders are naturally afraid of ants because they don't usually travel alone and they eat most arthropods, which includes spiders. There are even some species of spiders called ant spiders that disguise themselves as ants to deter larger spiders from attacking them

In a sense, it is crack to them. Ants prefer simple sugars for energy, since it gives them a big boost with minimal processing. And cane sugar (sucrose) is one of the six basic sugar molecules. You couldn't offer them a more enticing treat. Except maybe honey because that's fructose and glucose with some protein and enzymes mixed in.


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Well, I learned something new today.

Both spiders are running free outside and there doesn't seem to be a natural household remedy to get rid of ants.

I dumped coffee grounds on their nest and washed all their passages with vinegar and when I woke up the kitchen was full of them.


You can mix borax with either honey or sugar water and they will take it. Just don't leave it where kids can get to it because it's toxic to humans too. When food is found it is shared with the entire colony, including the queen. Once the queen dies the colony is doomed.

Or you could just capture the queen and some workers and start your own colony. Ant Love Forever.


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I kind of don't want to murder them and they're digging holes from weak spots in the concrete.

does that make them pavement ants?


Several genera of ants have been known to nest in concrete, to include common genera such as tetramorium (pavement ants), paratrechina (black crazy ants), nylanderia (tawny crazy ants), anopoplepis (yellow crazy ants), monomorium (Pharoah ants), lasius (common black ants), and phiedole (brown big headed ants), as well as some others I'm not yet familiar with.

If you had some close up pictures I could try to ID them for you.


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I don't think I have the best equipment for it, but we can try


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Funny thing

I came home to a trickle of ants streaming around the house.

Put the bags outside and just swept all the visible ants outside with a broom.
Now ant traffic has diminished to an occasional ant going back and forth.

I do wonder how ants move about their ways.
How much are they aware of human presence?


Stupid minimoths get out reeeeeeeee


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Honestly I'm super arachnophobic.
One of the things that helps me is just knowing how dumb spiders are.

When breeders work with tarantulas, the babies have to be shoved into pill bottles and old film canisters when they hatch, otherwise their stupid spider brains go "OH GOD EVERYTHING IS SO BIG" and die of shock.

It's so dumb but it comforts me a bit.


First pic is useless but the second one has just enough detail to attempt an educated guess at the genus. The head shape suggests formica, but I won't be able to say for certain without an accurate length in mm. Though unless your thumb is quite large they don't look big enough for formica.

It's definitely not tetramorium or lasius though. Is that brown or black? And can you get a decent shot of the antennae?

For the most part they only notice us through what we do directly to them. Their eyesight is very poor and they have no need for hearing.


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Their antennae are pretty light in colour, so it's hard to really catch it on cam. I find it's a bent shape about as long as their leg, I'd say.

I also know that they have not bitten me or hurt me yet, even when I grasp them well.

From sight, I'd say they're mostly black, but black and dark brown are close anyways. They do have that sort of translucence in their abdomen.


>>746373  a long time ago, I lived in a small 1br apartment on the bottom floor corner of a complex.  because it didn't have central heating/air, I moved my bed to the living room in the middle of summer.  one day, I woke up to dozens of ants crawling all over my bed.  they had established a trail to the kitchen, across the living room, and got lost and sidetracked by my bed sheets/blanket.  I tried to entice them with some food outside, but they kept going back for the kitchen, so I had to wipe them out with some ant bait.


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>They're a much older order of life and they'll be here long after we're gone.

Not if I can help it.


All ants have elbowed antennae, but that description does tell me two things: they aren't black crazy ants because their antennae aren't as long as their body, and they aren't Brachymyrmex because they have more than 9 segments to their antennae. Unfortunately the biggest clue from the antennae comes from their precise location on the head, and I'm not sure if I'd be able to walk you through that one because even I have trouble seeing it with the naked eye.

Also, docile rules out most myrmicine genera.
Can you try to estimate their body length (excluding legs and antennae) in millimeters? If you're unsure, the last segment of your pinkie finger should be 10mm wide.


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You can try, Cricket.


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I can try to estimate fairly .

One thing, I am Western European and I'm pretty sure they will be a very common species here.

about 5 millimeter
the antennae look like they start from close above the mandibles and go out to the side.

I am also thinking how long I can keep these around before going chemical warfare on them.
I can stand a few ants exploring, but I don't want to have them pouring out back and forth from their nest.

Heh, I've seen spiders drown themselves in any open vessel of water out in the open.


>drown themselves in any available water

just like humans


>I am Western European and I'm pretty sure they will be a very common species here.
... yes I suppose that should have been my first question
Iberoformica subrufa is the most likely candidate.


>but I don't want to have them pouring out back and forth from their nest.
that's going to happen if they find anything


Alternatively,  you could build a small formicarium and harvest any that venture out until the queen is forced to emerge,  then capture the queen and start caring for your new colony


>>746703  does that actually work?


Capturing the queen or forcing the queen out?

You can't always convince the queen to leave her nest, as some queens never leave the nursery. However, urban species are known to rotate nests, and if you catch them during a move the queen WILL be visible, surrounded by an entourage of majors if its a polymorphic species.
The queen is the heart of the colony. Without her the colony dies, and wherever she is the colony thrives. So if you capture the queen, even a mature queen, you have essentially captured a colony. However while the queen is the heart, the workers are the lifeblood so you would need to also capture a few workers or the queen could die.

In short, yes, you can literally harvest a wild colony if you have a suitable formicarium ready and you capture the queen with some workers.
this is actually the only way to acquire a Paratrechina longicornis queen as they are polygynous (multiple queens to a colony) and mate inside the nest, often from the same colony, by utilizing a double cloning technique unique to their species.


>>746843  forcing the queen out
have you done this before?


I don't suppose I can keep hitting the mooks until the boss comes out.
I don't think I've ever seen anything beyond the workers and the maiden flight young queens.

I suppose they won't migrate away if I bully them enough or block the entrance?

As much as I 'd be interested in a controlled formicarium, I lack the space and probably won't have the dedication to make this go well.


I've never done it by harvesting workers, so I don't know, but I've stolen wild queens from polygynous colonies before.

They have alates? That must be a very mature colony.
Unfortunately the only way to encourage them to leave is to make the environment unsuitable for them, but if they're in your house they likely prefer the same conditions you do. It's true that ants dislike vinegar, but if you already tried that there's not much left you can do without killing or physically moving them


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> get home
> 2 ants apparently snuck into the fridge somehow
> quasi dead, curled up onmovable in some icecold fridge pool
> 1 half encased in ice
> pick them up
> let them sit on my hand for a while
> they slowy start to wake up and within a minute are back to their own business

Ants are pretty resilient in some ways.

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